Everyone Bleeds in Afghanistan
By Anwaar Hussain
Robert Michael Gates, the 22nd United States Secretary of Defense, spoke at a press conference recently in Kabul. “There is still much fighting ahead, and there will assuredly be more dark days….but there is reason to be hopeful that Afghan and coalition forces can rout the hardest elements of the Taliban and establish security for the rest of the population.” he said.
‘Rout’, he said. What then, someone should have asked.
Robert Michael Gates needs to go to a game of Buzkashi in Afghanistan.
A time-honored game of the steppe people in Central Asian region, Buzkashi is a wild sport. Skilled riders attempt to grab the carcass of a headless goat or calf from the ground while riding a horse at full gallop. The aim is to get clear of other players and throw it across a goal line or into a target circle.
From Scythians, Bactrians and Aryans to the later Arachosians, many civilizations of the yore have played the game of Buzkashi for countless centuries over the region with Afghanistan being the prized carcass. In time, from Median and Persian Empires to Alexander the Great, the Seleucids, the Indo-Greeks, the Indians, the Turks and the Mongols, a host of other people appeared on the horizons to join the game on one side or the other. No sooner would one team exit when another would join the activity. Called the Great Game in recent times, the blood sport was continued with old fervor by the British, the Soviets, and most recently by the United States and their allies.
Land grab then and land grab now has been the chief aim of the invading teams all along. The invaders and the defenders, though, have been responding to various rallying cries. The leaders of the time sounded these calls from bullhorns of ideologies as diverse as of Pre-Zoroastrian to post-Zoroastrian Iranian to Buddhist to Hindu to Islamic religious thoughts to an out and out appeal to lust for spoils of war to the ‘War on Terror’ of today.
Historically, however, in Afghanistan the winning sides stayed the winners for short spans of time. They came, they won, they sparkled for a brief moment and then faded into the mist of times as if they never were. After a brief revival period of an expectant lull, the game would start afresh. In the current game, America and its allies are on one side and most of the rest on the other.
There is only one consistent lesson one learns from the eons long game played over Afghanistan. Everyone bled then, everyone bleeds now and everyone will bleed long after the current spell of the game is over whatever the outcome and whatever the American decisions to affect that outcome.
The Afghans are bleeding because their social fabric is of a society that, though held loosely by a common religion, is interwoven with strong strands of racial animosities. And they will bleed because carrying these enmities, they sit on a part of real estate whose geopolitical importance to the Empire builders only increases with each passing day. Their attitude, the Afghans will not change, and their geography, they cannot. They will thus remain a battleground on which ideologies, greed and politics of various regional and alien interests will continue to clash till the Afghans bring a change from within.
The neighbours, Pakistan being the case in point, are bleeding because in their quest for ‘strategic depth’ in Afghanistan, they reared a breed of foot soldiers on divine diet of hate to defeat the Soviets. And they will bleed because they neither know how to deprogram the zombies nor to explain to them why heavens and its resident hoories were promised as a reward in the fight against the ‘godless’ Russians but not any more when fighting the ‘infidel’ Americans and their local sidekicks.
For the Americans, however, the situation is especially ironic. Firstly, as a fool returns to his folly, the Americans came back to kill their own creations. Secondly, if turmoil and insecurity indeed were the reasons the Americans initially came to Afghanistan, as they would like the world to believe, it makes no sense to now leave in greater disarray not only that country but almost the entire surrounding region. Yet they cannot stay on for reasons obvious enough to even fresh entrants into the State Department. They stay and fight, they bleed. They quit and run, they bleed. They do neither, they bleed. Talk of double binds.
The Americans and their allies are bleeding because they have conquered a land of which they neither know the culture, nor the custom, nor the religion nor the brew that the three things make. They can succeed only if they ruin the Afghans into oblivion, a physical impossibility, or reside here in person, which they cannot forever, or permit them to live under their own laws by establishing within it a cabal which will keep it friendly to them, something already tried and miserably failed at.
And they will bleed for a whole range of reasons. They will bleed because they don’t let go of easily what they once conquer and because of the energy, sapped of which as they already are, required to hold fast onto distant lands inhabited by alien peoples. And if they decide to depart leaving behind a few garrisons and a toady regime, they will bleed not only because of the nerve wracking wariness required to remaining alert to another great power starting a fresh stint of the game but also due to the resources wasted in the continuous long range knee-jerking that false alarms tend to induce from afar.
All the same, once the present game of Buzkashi is over, with the wasted heroes lowered in to their graves in flag draped caskets, the politicians will promptly wash the blood off their hands with well worded sorrow. The remaining foot soldiers, called the choppendoz in Buzkashi, will await the call from the bullhorn for the next bleeding round.
Everyone bleeds in Afghanistan.
X-X-X-X
If words would have made a difference the many advises in the form of writ-ups by good men would have taken heed from history to make the world a better place for all its inhabitants. that has not been the case and given the greed and arrogance of the human race I have no reason to believe that the trend will change. Yes the actors will continue to change but history will keep repeating itself because we will continue to repeat our mistakes. The slide started from the first murder or even earlier when the first man disobeyed the warning from God. Sad but true. Great and true article as ever Anwaar. Keep it up. You continue to aspire the thinking minds and surely must have added great many fans by now. But then that is the other side of man; the good side, where sane people like you will continue to strive to bring out the truth.
March 10th, 2010 at 3:25 pmwhile the geographic entity of the term afghanistan is relatively new,so is it’s geographic importance,which most fail to understand.the Britt’s,created the afghanistan concept & brought it to limelight,because of the fear of the ;;Bear’.in the mughal period it was and remained divided in provinces,prior to that
March 10th, 2010 at 3:28 pmcity states confined to fortresses,only in ghaznavid period did have a power, but then it was known as ”Zabulistan”.
Thank you, Anwaar, for this informative article. The goat in the game of Buzkashi does indeed seem to be an apt metaphor for other countries’ attitudes towards Afghanistan.
March 10th, 2010 at 5:28 pmYes, everyone bleeds, except the jews. They profit.
March 10th, 2010 at 6:15 pmAmeriKa is way beyond saving. The corpocratic militocracy is plummeting headlong to its inevitable doom. Let’s hope this obscene and headless beast of eternal war will be dumped on the other side of the goalpost of history in the not too distant future. We can all do a little to further the decline of this immoral experiment in greed by boycotting whatever the killing machine still manufactures as well as the shoddy goods of death of its surrogate killing machine in apartheid occupied Palestine.
Onward with Al Jolson the current “White” house resident!
March 10th, 2010 at 7:02 pmAnwaar, I enjoyed reading it. But I am feeling a bit embarrassed to accept that I missed the point Naveed Tajammal is trying to make in the context of your article!!!
March 10th, 2010 at 7:42 pm“Historically, however, in Afghanistan the winning sides stayed the winners for short spans of time. They came, they won, they sparkled for a brief moment and then faded into the mist of times as if they never were. After a brief revival period of an expectant lull, the game would start afresh. In the current game, America and its allies are on one side and most of the rest on the other.”
Who are “most of the rest”?
March 10th, 2010 at 8:04 pmAfghans (mainly pashtuns) claim that they tolerate no foreign domination, and that it proves that they are a proud, brave, freedom-loving people. But they have been tolerating, even dying and killing for, the islamic-arabic imperialism under which they have come 11 to 12 centuries ago.
The afghan claim of being a self-respecting, freedom-loving proud, brave people will be credible only after the afgans get rid of the arabic and islamic imperialism under which they have lived as quislings for so many centuries.
US-CIA and the triad-CIA (China-Islam-Arabs) have misused peoples (in Afghanistan and Pakistan) and ruined them. These evil CIA’s have to be replaced by a new CIA comprising of Courage, Intelligence and Authenticity. The authenticity will be manifest in writing an honest history that does not glorify islam and arabs.
March 10th, 2010 at 9:52 pmRe: Masroor,
Consider me a party to your embarrassment. I am equally at a loss.
Re: Oppenheim,
Ah!, we finally have you here.
The answer to your question?
Easy really…..separate the losers from the profiteers in the world and most of the rest will sympathize with the oppressed. ‘Most of the rest’ that is….some overtly, some covertly…as is happening with your country in Afghanistan. You think the Afghans alone could have sustained the resistance?
Think…
March 10th, 2010 at 10:28 pmI too in recent years have expressed displeasure with the “Grand Game” wrapper developed out of the Victorian-era perception of European adventure and contests for resources and trade. Contemporary and derisive reference rightly acknowledges the cultural and territorial legitimacy and integrity of people once the target of earlier processes. At the same time, while the old “Grand Game” takes its knocks on the way to dismissal altogether, pointing the finger westward deflects attention from the following:
1. Issues, including internecine local or tribal conflicts, and cultural assumptions and values, including those that would, for example, prevent children from recieving their polio vaccinations, that exist within a region independent of foreign enterprise or meddling.
2. Less customary but no less potent and disruptive or destructive colonizing forces.
Binary rhetorical divisions such as “profiteers” vs. “oppressed” belie more complex cultural, economic, and political realities, especially in light of the development and longevity of kleptocracies or structures similar from Bangladesh and Burma to Cameroon and Zimbabwe. Around the world, we have too many wearing the de factor “president for life” title, and each one of them is a profiteer. The oppressed of such are as likely to look toward the United States and so many other open societies for relief and succor as to look anywhere else.
March 11th, 2010 at 1:08 amMy impression of situation in Afghanistan, rightly or wrongly, can be summarized as follows:
The first time a major news about Afghanistan attracted me when I learned Russia had invaded Afghanistan. I knew for sure that Russians are colonizers and once they capture a country, it becomes part of their Empire. The Russians were repulsed by whatever mechanism (who cares) but once Russians were gone, no new news in Afghanistan to attract any ordinary Muslim’s attention.
Then the news of Taliban’s atrocities such as beheadings and burning of girls’ schools, demolishing statute of Buddha and other atrocities attracted my attention. I became concerned because the world will feel all Muslims are like Talibans. But I was contented because all the turmoil was confined in Afghanistan, the same way that what happens in Somalia or Sudan, will not distort the image of Muslims in the world.
Then came the news of America invading Afghanistan. The given reason was that Osama Bin Laden and Mullah Omar were in Afghanistan and America claimed they were master-mind behind 911 attacks. My gut feeling is America has no intention like Russians to colonize Afghanistan. They just want to capture or destroy their enemies. America has no colony outside their borders. If indeed they wanted to expand their territory, they would have conquered Canada and Mexico.
Anwaar, your article looks at the situation in Afghanistan from different angle that is historical background and you have successfully connected the dots.
March 11th, 2010 at 5:05 amI think that our long and earnest attempt to live by the sweat of another man’s brow is coming to an end. The use of force and fraud, which defines political government, always comes to this end. Western civilization is bankrupt intellectually and financially. It’s dying. The question is, after this Great Game is over, will we play it again?
March 11th, 2010 at 6:12 amRe: Oppenheim
I tend to agree with your caution in using the words “profiteers” vs. “oppressed” with a rather broad brush. However, won’t you agree that the words do generally cover the excesses of Empires? In my opinion going into the finer nuances of ‘complex cultural, economic, and political realities’ of the victims each time one talks of imperial overkills would prove a rather tiresome exercise.
Your points 1 and 2 are alluded to in the article.
Thanks,
Anwaar
March 11th, 2010 at 7:58 amRe : Robert Klassen
“The question is, after this Great Game is over, will we play it again?”
But of course we will. Unless, and that is a long shot, the Afghans get tired of their country being the playground of Grand Masters. The Chinese giant is just awakening, flexing its muscles and surveying the world scene. The Russians, though down and out for now, may see a revival in not too distant a future. In any case, the two of them together won’t like a distant imperialist to continue to play games in their neighborhood. They would claim stakes sooner than later.
Regards,
Anwaar
March 11th, 2010 at 8:18 amHmm, I see that there are some interpretations of events in Afghanistan that I think are over analyzed to some extent, I mean that I think it is all about oil, particularly who will control the oil in the several ex-soviet Central Asian States that are loaded with the stuff. We need bases bordering these states to oppose a potential Russian or Chinese grab of this oil in a world of dwindling reserves, the war and the people of Afghanistan are simply in the wrong place and expendable to our wonderful peace loving USA Government and Military. That 9-11 was an inside job giving the excuse for this to take place becomes more obvious every day, we will build several mega bases to station a trip wire force and should Russia or China move towards any of these republics, we will move in with the vast fleet of cargo planes that the US continues to build, to be in place before the Russians or Chinese arrive, therefore making them risk starting a greater war if they don’t back down.
Poor Afghanistan, has the Lord abandoned you to a purgatory on Earth, your poor and mostly innocent people sold for the slaughter century after century, wishing only to live and love in peace, but placed in sorrow and fear never relenting, ever worse, your dead now called collateral damage, your children traumatized, terrorized for the profit of the obscenely rich. Please Lord make all weapons fail, and the knees grow week of all oppressors, may your sorrow be multiplied to your antagonists, and your pain assuaged with a salve of tenderness from those called of the Lord, and may peace reign for you forever and complete!
March 11th, 2010 at 8:26 amHistory has been the greatest teacher of all times, awash with lessons, albeit for those who want to learn. Apparently, the latest adventurers of “The great game” have ventured with either total disdain toward history, or an utter arrogance which develops only with the notion of being supremo, disregard to human values, greed, and godly feeling of being omnipotent. We’ve very recently witnessed a super power being disintegrated into the same battlefield. Are we going to witness another fall from glory? Time’ll tell us that but meanwhile, like the scribe said, allied forces will bleed in Afghanistan. Let’s watch and draw our own lessons.
March 11th, 2010 at 10:45 amI was seated on my couch watching the Pentagon burn. The date was 9/11/2001. The phone began to ring.
Q. “Are you being called up.”
A. “Where? We don’t even know who the hell did
this yet?”
At work, the same line of questioning and in days to come the same seeking of assurance that the American government would respond.
Respond we did.
Root cause analysis would be good.
The American public would not have supported a theater of operation in Afghanistan if a game of Buzkashi had not been played against us first. Headless goats? I had a friend in New York on 9/11 who scurried off to give blood. He was told to go home, there was little need for life-saving blood products.
A man stripped of his citizenship, detested by his own nation, incapable of signing a treaty or declaring an act of war, did just that. The ribaat of Afghanistan welcomed him and the rest we all know.
LCDR Tammy Swofford, USNR, NC
March 11th, 2010 at 5:25 pmWith tens of millions of Americans on the financial ropes today while substantial sums of American aid find their way to Pakistan and Afghanistan (also while American and other foreign blood spills around the Durand Line), foregoing the detailed history and politics of the region in favor of summing, however poetically, into any number of tried and untrue ideological myths makes for a grievous fault.
Here there is a story perhaps too large to comprehend, and it’s one that decimates the “Grand Game” perception in contemporary politics. From a U.S. think-tank comes a conservative denial of the depth of China’s involvement in America’s economy: http://blog.heritage.org/2010/01/06/china-is-not-americas-banker/ It’s an odd article, myth-defying in its claims, but $800 million USD and such make a persistent statement about the authenticity of global rivalries. Like it or not, whether we understand it or not, we are all getting down the road together with agricultural and industrial and associated human development a light on the horizon and nuclear warfare its grim and black-hole opposite.
Every our national treasure chests are not as discrete or separated as they once were: we have really got our hands in each other’s pockets.
To stay with you, I think I will have to re-read Ahmed Rashid’s _Descent into Chaos_.
Also, following Tammy’s remark, one might recall that if not for the murder or rape of two girls at a Soviet checkpost, Mullah Omar may have never whipped together a war party, hung the Soviet commander from a tank barrel, and gone on into Pakistan to recruit a force to rebuff the blowback from having taken revenge.
Not only devils reside in the history’s details but many angels–many sensible puzzle parts–too. Imho, truth wants for illumination, not gloss.
March 11th, 2010 at 7:12 pmI mean “$800 billion”: “The federal government runs a gigantic budget deficit, which will hurt the economy for the next decade. China buys some of the bonds sold to finance that deficit and has about $800 billion in official holdings of Treasuries, plus perhaps an equal amount in other types of holdings” — from the Heritage article cited.
March 11th, 2010 at 7:13 pmAfghans have to take responsibility for their own misdeeds, mismanagements, backwardness, racism, genocides (internal and external), irrationality etc.
The above comments touch none of this.
Basically Afghans have developed an ideology of pseudo-honor, pseudo-freedom, pseudo-history and pseudo-religion and they are not being honest and self-critical at all.
US-CIA is known to be roguish, the triad-CIA comprising of China, Islam, Arabs has its own totalitarian, imperialist, racist and ethno-fascist interests and methods. When will pakistanis and afghans develop the intelligence and wisdom to see this and get out of the strangulating coils of these alien CIA’s, these poisonous serpents and dragons?
March 12th, 2010 at 4:37 pmDear Vishvas.
I strongly feel Pakistan must stick with United States if India sticks with Russia. United States can play greater role in stability of South Asia than Russia. See below the latest news:
Los Angeles Times
By Mark Magnier
March 13, 2010
Reporting from New Delhi
“India signed five deals Friday to purchase more than $7 billion in hardware and expertise from Russia, including an aircraft carrier, a fleet of MIG-29 fighters, defense and space technology and at least 12 civilian nuclear reactors.”
“The Russian carrier Admiral Gorshkov is slated for delivery in 2012 with a complement of 45 MIG-29 fighter jets. Having the ship also will allow India to send adversary Pakistan a message when it sees fit. The nuclear-armed neighbors have fought three major wars since their division in 1947.”
March 13th, 2010 at 8:37 amAnother incisive and analytical article as usual, Anwaar. The Great Game will continue, albeit in spurts, as long as we, humans stay on this good earth.
Re: G. Vishvas
Your views on ‘islamic-arabic imperialism’,'pseudo-honor, pseudo-freedom, pseudo-history and pseudo-religion remind me of a sleep walker who, in a dream like state, only knows about his immediate surroundings while remaining oblivious to larger perspective and ground realities.You may appreciate that all major religions stemmed from what is dubbed now as Middle East. When humans internalize a belief or religion they stick to it and kill or die for it.Just move back farther in history, and you will find that religion, whichever, is inextricably entwined with humans without which they could not exist.Going that far will also reveal that all religions (including Indian, Egyptian, Chinese and Greek mythologies), have so much common between them. This too is not without a reason.After all what is so different between God, Amen Ra, Allah, Ram, Zeus and the like? And why do we have similar archetypes like saaya, chhaya, shadow, escape- goat and some rituals like fasting and praying?
All civilizations were and are imperialistic, the difference being only in degrees.
Whatever you call ‘pseudo’ is pseudo from your point of view, not the populace that believes in it. No one has given us the mantle to dub others’ beliefs as pseudo; we never know our own may be equally pseudo. We cannot pass judgments wearing the colored glasses of our limited experiences giving access to tunneled vision only.
Vishvas, I did not write this to take sides; I just want to put the record straight, so our argument is not lop-sided.
March 14th, 2010 at 12:28 pmTo Mustafa
India has always remained free of any totalitarian pacts with USSR or Russia or anyone else. Indira Gandhi was the only person who could defy Brezhnev and he knew it. US-CIA and the triad-CIA comprising of China, Islam, Arabs have ruined Pakistan. The true identity of a Pakistani is Hindu (=inhabitant of the Sindhu river basin). Islam has taught or compelled him to hate everything hindu and become a quisling of arabs, turks, China and USA. When Pakistanis develop the socio-political intelligence to comprehend this the world in South Asia will begin to look different. But islam, an ideology from Arabia and not one created in the Sindhu river basin, will not allow Pakistanis to develop such an intelligence and wisdom. For arabs, turks, Chinese and US-americans we in the Indian Subcontinent (ISC) are just idiots to be misused for their own ethno-fascist and imperialist goals. Islam is not an ideology created in the ISC and hence quislings and followers of islam have no right to determine politics, boundaries, culture faiths etc. in the ISC. That is my self-respect and dignity as inhabitant of the ISC.
To Pervaiz Alam
One should not fall into the fallacy of everything is relative. I have to keep saying that islam is a totalitarian arab-imperialist blasphemous ideology whether or not anyone listens or agrees. Just because people want to live in their cocoons and tribal idiocies of the past does not mean we have to remain silent about it. New generations will be born who are tired of this tribalism and idiocies and they will thank us that we kept telling the truth and did not resign into relativism or into the fallacy of tolerating the intolerant. Life is going to be exceedingly hard for the new generations and a person like me who has no resources except the email can help them only by not being an opportunist or coward or relativist.
I remember a debate in which a religionist (a muslim) accused the scientists of having their own faith and thought that he had won the argument for religion. He had to be told that the genuine scientist calls his own faith (in his results and axioms) into question repeatedly and even encourages such questioning, whereas a genuine religionist reacts to questions and doubts about his faith with anger, tantrums and even violence. Then he was quiet and made a face like a rat that has bitten into a piece of sharp glass.
Certain things raally are pseudo – and sooner or later some of those who revel in these pseudos will change for the better, towards honesty. It is these some who are important. In USA they have now founded a council of ex-muslims. How did that happen?
March 14th, 2010 at 5:02 pmDear Vishvas, your Islam bashing is unwarranted. For your information I am posting here what prominent Non-Muslims say about Islam.
“there is much that the world can learn from Islam. It is now practiced by one of every four people on Earth.” President Clinton, White House Eid ul-Fitr presentation, Jan. 10, 2000
“Islam is the fastest-growing religion in America, a guide and pillar of stability for many of our people…” HILLARY CLINTON, Los Angeles Times, May 31, 1996, p.3
Already more than a billion-people strong, Islam is the world’s fastest-growing religion. ABCNEWS, Abcnews.com
“Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the country.” NEWSDAY.
“Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the United States…” NEW YORK TIMES
Moslems are the world’s fastest-growing group…” USA TODAY, The population referance bureau,
“Muhammed is the most successful of all Prophets and religious personalities. ” Encyclopedia Britannica
“There are more Muslims in North America than Jews Now.” Dan Rathers, ABCNEWS
“Islam is the fastest growing religion in North America.” TIMES MAGAZINE
“Islam continues to grow in America, and no one can doubt that!” CNN,
“The religion of Islam is growing faster than any other religion in the world.” MIKE WALLACE, 60 MINUTES
“Five to 6 million strong, Muslims in America already outnumber Presbyterians, Episcopalians, and Mormons, and they are more numerous than Quakers, Unitarians, Seventh-day Adventists, Mennonites, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and Christian Scientists, combined. Many demographers say Islam has overtaken Judaism as the country’s second-most commonly practiced religion; others say it is in the passing lane.” JOHAN BLANK, USNEWS
“In fact, religion experts say Islam is the second-largest religion in the United States… Islam has 5 million to 6 million members, followed by Judaism, with approximately 4.5 million….. And Islam is believed to be fastest-growing religion in the country, with half its expansion coming from new immigrants and the other half from conversions.” By ELSA C. ARNETT Knight-Ridder News Service
Professor Keith Moore, one of the world’s prominent scientists of anatomy and embryology. University of Toronto, Canada It has been a great pleasure for me to help clarify statements in the Qur’aan about human development. It is clear to me that these statements must have come to Muhammad from God, or ‘Allah’, because almost all of this knowledge was not discovered until many centuries later. This proves to me that Muhammad must have been a messenger of Allah.
“It seems to me that Muhammad was a very ordinary man, he couldn’t read, didn’t know how to write, in fact he was an illiterate…
We’re talking about 1400 years ago, you have some illiterate person making profound statements that are amazingly accurate, of a scientific nature…
I personally can’t see how this could be mere chance, there are too many accuracies and like Dr. Moore, I have no difficulty in my mind reconciling that this is a divine inspiration or revelation which lead him to these statements.” T.V.N. Persaud
Professor of Anatomy, and Professor of Paediatrics and Child Health, University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada.
“…In a relatively few ayahs (Qur’ânic verses) is contained a rather comprehensive description of human development from the time of commingling of the gametes through organogenesis. No such distinct and complete record of human development such as classification, terminology, and description existed previously. In most, if not all instances, this description antedates by many centuries the recording of the various stages of human embryonic and fetal development recorded in the traditional scientific literature.” Gerald C. Goeringer Professor and Co-ordinator of Medical Embryology in the Department of Cell Biology, School of Medicine, Georgetown University, Washington DC, USA.
“…our knowledge of these disciplines is such, that it is impossible to explain how a text produced at the time of the Qur’ân could have contained ideas that have only been discovered in modern times.”… “The above observation makes the hypothesis advanced by those who see Muhammad as the author of the Qur’ân untenable. How could a man, from being illiterate, become the most important author, in terms of literary merits, in the whole of Arabic literature?.. Dr. Maurice Bucaille.. former chief of the Surgical Clinic, University of Paris
Professor William W. Hay is one of the best known marine scientists in the United States. satellite photography and emote-sensing techniques. Professor Hay replied: I find it very interesting that this sort of information is in the ancient scripture of the Holy Qur’aan, and I have no way of knowing where they would come from, but I think it is extremely interesting that they are there and that this work is going on to discover it, the meaning of some of the passages. Professor Hay: Well, I would think it must be the divine being!
Professor Yushudi Kusan: Director of the Tokyo Observatory,
I can say, I am very much impressed by finding true astronomical facts in the Qur’aan.
“As a scientist, I can only deal with things which I can specifically see. I can understand embryology and developmental biology. I can understand the words that are translated to me from the Qur’ân. As I gave the example before, if I were to transpose myself into that era, knowing what I do today and describing things, I could not describe the things that were described”– E. Marshall Johnson Professor and Chairman of the Department of Anatomy and Developmental Biology, and Director of the Daniel Baugh Institute, Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA.
Joe Leigh Simpson, Professor of Obstetrics and Gynecology at the North Western University in Chicago in the United States of America. Professor Simpson said: It follows, I think, that not only is there no conflict between genetics and religion, but in fact religion can guide science by adding revelation to some traditional scientific approaches. That there exists statements in the Qur’aan shown by science to be valid, which supports knowledge in the Qur’aan having been derived from Allah.
Professor Palmer a scientist from the U.S.
We need research into the history of early Middle Eastern oral traditions to know whether in fact such historical events have been reported. If there is no such record, it strengthens the belief that Allah transmitted through Muhammad bits of his knowledge that we have only discovered for ourselves in recent times. We look forward to a continuing dialogue on the topic of science in the Qur’aan in the context of geology. Thank you very much.
“My choice of Muhammad to lead the list of the world’s most influential persons may surprise some readers and may be questioned by others, but he was the only man in history who was supremely successful on both the religious and secular level.” –Michael H. Hart, THE 100: A RANKING OF THE MOST INFLUENTIAL PERSONS IN HISTORY, New York: Hart Publishing Company, Inc., 1978, p. 33.
“No other society has such a record of success in uniting in an equality of status, of opportunity and endeavour so many and so varied races of mankind. The great Muslim communities of Africa, India and Indonesia, perhaps also the small community in Japan, show that Islam has still the power to reconcile apparently irreconcilable elements of race and tradition. If ever the opposition of the great societies of the East and west is to be replaced by cooperation, the mediation of Islam is an indispensable condition.” (H.A.R. Gibb, WHITHER ISLAM, p. 379)
“Four years after the death of Justinian, A.D. 569, was born at Mecca, in Arabia the man who, of all men exercised the greatest influence upon the human race . . . Mohammed . . . ” John William Draper, M.D., L.L.D., A History of the Intellectual Development of Europe, London 1875, Vol.1, pp.329-330
“Sense of justice is one of the most wonderful ideals of Islam, because as I read in the Qur’an I find those dynamic principles of life, not mystic but practical ethics for the daily conduct of life suited to the whole world.” –Lectures on “The Ideals of Islam;” see SPEECHES AND WRITINGS OF SAROJINI NAIDU, Madras, 1918, p. 167.
“The Muslim community is much more aware of its religion and the use that religion plays within its community.” Dr Peter Brierley, executive director of the Christian Research Association, a London-based charity
“The extinction of race consciousness as between Muslims is one of the outstanding achievements of Islam, and in the contemporary world there is, as it happens, a crying need for the propagation of this Islamic virtue.” –A.J. Toynbee, CIVILIZATION ON TRIAL, New York, 1948, p. 205.
“I am not a Muslim in the usual sense, though I hope I am a “Muslim” as “one surrendered to God,” but I believe that embedded in the Quran and other expressions of the Islamic vision are vast stores of divine truth from which I and other occidentals have still much to learn, and ‘Islam is certainly a strong contender for the supplying of the basic framework of the one religion of the future.’” –W. Montgomery Watt, ISLAM AND CHRISTIANITY TODAY, London, 1983, p. ix.
‘I believe in One God and Mohammed the Apostle of God,’ is the simple and invariable profession of Islam. The intellectual image of the Deity has never been degraded by any visible idol; the honours of the prophet have never transgressed the measure of human virtue, and his living precepts have restrained the gratitude of his disciples within the bounds of reason and religion.” –Edward Gibbon and Simon Ocklay, HISTORY OF THE SARACEN EMPIRE, London, 1870, p. 54.
“His readiness to undergo persecutions for his beliefs, the high moral character of the men who believed in him and looked up to him as leader, and the greatness of his ultimate achievement – all argue his fundamental integrity. To suppose Muhammad an impostor raises more problems than it solves. Moreover, none of the great figures of history is so poorly appreciated in the West as Muhammad.” –W. Montgomery Watt, MOHAMMAD AT MECCA, Oxford, 1953, p. 52.
“The doctrine of brotherhood of Islam extends to all human beings, no matter what color, race or creed. Islam is the only religion which has been able to realize this doctrine in practice. Muslims wherever on the world they are will recognize each other as brothers.” Mr. R. L. Mellema, Holland, Anthropologist, Writer and Scholar.
“It is impossible for anyone who studies the life and character of the great Prophet of Arabia, who knows how he taught and how he lived, to feel anything but reverence for that mighty Prophet, one of the great messengers of the Supreme. And although in what I put to you I shall say many things which may be familiar to many, yet I myself feel whenever I re-read them, a new way of admiration, a new sense of reverence for that mighty Arabian teacher.” –Annie Besant, THE LIFE AND TEACHINGS OF MUHAMMAD, Madras, 1932, p. 4.
“The essential and definite element of my conversion to Islam was the Qur’an. I began to study it before my conversion with the critical spirit of a Western intellectual …. There are certain verses of this book, the Qur’an, revealed more than thirteen centuries ago, which teach exactly the same notions as the most modern scientific researches do. This definitely converted me.”
Ali Selman Benoist, France, Doctor of Medicine.
“I have read the Sacred Scriptures of every religion; nowhere have I found what I encountered in Islam: perfection. The Holy Qur’an, compared to any other scripture I have read, is like the Sun compared to that of a match. I firmly believe that anybody who reads the Word of Allah with a mind that is not completely closed to Truth, will become a Muslim.” Saifuddin Dirk Walter Mosig, U. S.A.
“The universal brotherhood of Islam, regardless of race, politics, color or country, has been brought home to me most keenly many times in my life — and this is another feature which drew me towards the Faith.” Col. Donald S. Rockwell, U.S.A. Poet, Critic and Author.
“If a man like Muhammed were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world, he would succeed in solving its problems that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness.” George Bernard Shaw
March 14th, 2010 at 11:17 pmRe: Vishvas
I commented on the requirement, consequent emergence and the role religion has played in our lives. Indeed our psycho- social life without religion would not have been what it is today. But alas you reduced this profound topic into a farce by hurting billions of followers of a religion. Your out of the context Islam-bashing reminds me of Cervantes’ Don Quixote attacking the windmills.
When seen through the microscope of intellect, you may find that every faith is imperfect. Here, I will not venture to find faults with other faiths, least of all Hinduism. For despite all imperfections, they lull humanity to peace and tranquility.
Afghans are what they are due to illiteracy and absence of contact with the outside world. Their sense of pride may be ‘pseudo’ to you, but not for them. Allow me to say that you may not be necessarily right.
You admired the scientists’ way of thinking, but the very next moment narrated the story of a religious person hopelessly trying to defend his faith. Therein, you tried to prove that the person failed because the faith itself was faulty. Of course that is a fallacious deduction, and yet you claim that others make hasty generalizations.
All civilizations were and are imperialistic; the difference is only of degrees.
Afghans will change themselves through education or an emancipated leader, not by a pseudo intellectual (to borrow a term from you).
March 15th, 2010 at 9:39 pmSince the known history of “Alexander the Great” till date, none could tame “Afghanistan”, a poor small land locked country, our next door neighbour.
March 16th, 2010 at 3:02 pmre:masroor & admin,
March 31st, 2010 at 4:04 pmThe point stressed is,in history there is no entity of afghanistan,till british created as one !!
and it is a misconception that it was only the afghans who fought the russains, bulk of fighters came from east of durand line.bluntly the geographic entity now called afghanistan has been a subjected region by the powers of past times.
To naveed
Imperialists create new nations where none existed. see the boundaries in africa, drawn on paper using lineals. see the boundaries between Syria, jordan etc. It is the same case.
One always thinks of white europeans as imperialists – but muslims, arabs, turks, chinese too were and are imperialists.
Afghans must realize that islam is a non-afghan ideology from arabia. So self-respecting afghans will reject islam too. That will not immediately solve all problems, but will make way for modern honest solutions.
April 3rd, 2010 at 1:26 pmVishvas,your reply smells of Rashtriya Swayam Sewak Sangh Ideology,which is post 1925,the nagpur doctor who was the founder i.e HEDGEWAR, was clueless man as was the later,Golwalker,1940,a lecturer of science in a bombay college,you never mess with historical records,and antiquiting a religion too, never is a good idea, as was done by both Uncle & Nephew,the rhetoric of RSSS is a juvenile attempt to distort
April 4th, 2010 at 8:29 pmrecords, sindh was never cursed with hinduism,which is, if, you must call it a religion,post islam,as to khurassan, new name afghanistan, well it went in the muslim fold from buddhism and not hinduism,even your so called Rajput entity is post islam by two centuries,read and research before you open your mouth or use your fingers to type VISHVAS.lastly it has been the Sindh valley which has ruled the petty states which later were coined as an entity of Hind by the arab geographers.your Federation is on a brink of Balkanisation,VISHVAS,
so where will you go ???? Maldives ?? remember the ocean rises often in that area.and sharks will soon infest it,i hope you are a good swimmer.sweet dreams,and usa will soon leave afghanistan,too, the khatri of hind will be on the run then.afghan hounds are known to catch the culprit, when they are convinced of the culprit,internal dynamics is a subject by itself but a hindu hung over and brain washed by a stupid baseless ideology does falter.as is in your case, Vishwas.
@Naveed Tajammal
G. Vishvas is a known troll and a trouble-maker who promotes hatred of Muslims wherever he can, largely and strangely on Muslim-oriented sites like PakTeaHouse as much as on others. It is clear that he is not looking for a discussion, far less a decision, but just picking a fight, just seeking to irritate people because he has some prejudice against them. There is nothing that he can do in the real world against Muslims. So he keeps chasing them around in the electronic world, using these arguments to irritate them, and watching them get irritated is what gives him maximum pleasure.
You can watch him at PakTeaHouse, writing as globetrotter, as he was banned as G. Vishvas. Same poison, same dull, blunt idiot.
I understand your anger. But as a Hindu, and not one who hates Muslims or anyone who is not a bigot, I am sad that you should abuse all Hindus. That is the attitude of Vishvas, an idiot; I would hate to see anyone imitate him.
Please be sure that both Hindus and Muslims think that he is a figure of fun, and mock him, although he cannot make out that he is being mocked.
I hope that what you have written to him is not what you really think. I hope that you realize that there are good and bad people among all religions, all races, among Muslims and Hindus and Christians and Jews, and that it is not possible to condemn a whole religion for the faults of one or two half-wits.
May 15th, 2010 at 3:36 pmwell said varja, i was not aware of the doings of vishvas, infact manoj, had brought him in the loop in 2008 when he had started a indo-pak academia blog, and vishvas kept up endless barbs of baseless arguements,which he could never substantiate by references,i agree not all humans irrespective of religious inclinations are like him.one respects all religions but if goaded without reason,you do hit below the belt.it was a pleasure interacting with you on this forum.
June 2nd, 2010 at 10:03 pmPeople of the ISC need to rise above their petty squabbles brought about by an intolerant strand of Islam promoted by Saudi Arabia and their clients in the Pakistani military. Pakistan has destabilized the whole region by arming militant groups for their so called “strategic depth” and that depth is no guarantee against India because Afghans hate Pakistan and would love to see that country destroyed and Balkanized.
October 19th, 2010 at 9:45 pmIt is a pity and a shame that people in Pakistan do not own up to the fact that before the advent of Islam a mere 1400 years ago, all of the people in current day Pakistan were Hindus or Buddhists. The funny thing is that when a woman gets married in Pakistan they wear a red outfit which is a Hindu tradition and they still accept dowries from the bride another Hindu tradition. Pakistan…what a funny concept.
October 19th, 2010 at 9:56 pm